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Glossary entry

German term or phrase:

aus dem Talon ziehen

English translation:

The matchmaker/marriage broker likely pulled Herrmann Kafka's name out of the stack

Added to glossary by Veronika McLaren
Jun 8, 2009 20:38
14 yrs ago
German term

aus dem Talon ziehen

German to English Art/Literary Games / Video Games / Gaming / Casino cards
I can't work out whether this is meant as a compliment or not! It's from a section on Kafka's family in a guide to Prague.

"Die Tochter wuchs ins heiratsfähige Alter heran und wurde schließlich einem Schadchen überantwortet, also einem jüdischen Heiratsvermittler. Dieser dürfte Hermann Kafka **aus dem Talon gezogen haben**."
Proposed translations (English)
3 +2 The matchmaker/marriage broker likely pulled Herrmann Kafka's name out of the stack
4 +1 must have pulled the name out of a hat
3 draw from the reserve pile of 'undealt cards'
2 put forward
Change log

Jun 12, 2009 14:04: Veronika McLaren Created KOG entry

Discussion

Ingeborg Gowans (X) Jun 8, 2009:
oops well, I was certainly on the wrong track here, sorry, I learned something new!
Veronika McLaren Jun 8, 2009:
Julie came from a well-to-do family while Herrmann's family was poor. The "talon" (French - Austrian) refers to the stack of cards not dealt in a game.
Ingeborg Gowans (X) Jun 8, 2009:
stupid question so Hermann Kafka married Julie? Then I would understand this to be: she helped him in a time of need and the arranged marriage solved his problems (not knowing more about the background history).
Rachel Ward (asker) Jun 8, 2009:
@Ingeborg - it seems to me to relate to playing cards so I thougt it went with "casion/gaming".


@John: "Freilich - auch Julie hatte in ihrer Jugend den Haushalt führen und für die jüngeren Kinder sorgen müssen, die ihre früh verstorbene Mutter zurückgelassen hatte. Da fiel es ihr nicht schwer, dem angetrauten Gatten zur Seite zu stehen und im
Geschäft anzupacken."
John Fenz Jun 8, 2009:
The subsequent sentence? What is the sentence immediately following "Dieser dürfte Hermann Kafka aus dem Talon gezogen haben". I can think of a couple of idioms that capture the flavor of "aus dem Talon ziehen", but would need more context to determine the most appropriate."
Ingeborg Gowans (X) Jun 8, 2009:
video/gaming? Are you sure you put in the right field? Wouldn't it be rather tourism/ travel? Just a thought, I am still checking for the term in question

Proposed translations

+2
38 mins
Selected

The matchmaker/marriage broker likely pulled Herrmann Kafka's name out of the stack

...?
Peer comment(s):
agree Barbara Wiebking : Sounds smooth...
21 mins
Thank you, kriddl!
agree Helen Shiner : though I would use 'pack' rather than 'stack' which sounds like rather a lot of cards./You could perhaps use John's 'reserve' - pulled his name out of the reserve pack.
2 hrs
Thank you, Helen - sounds good that way.
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks Veronika!"
37 mins

put forward

Maybe something like this? It seems like "der Talon" literally describes the cards that are left after the cards have been dealt out (see Veronika's comment) and is used in this sense both in English and German:

'Mr. Dawkins nahm das Kompliment mit philosophischer Ruhe entgegen und forderte die Herren der Gesellschaft auf, mit ihm einen Shilling zu wetten, daß er jedesmal eine beliebige Karte aus dem Talon ziehen werde.'
http://www.zeno.org/Literatur/M/Dickens, Charles/Romane/Oliv...

'At this stage, there is not enough information to choose between them - it depends on which cards are due to come out of the talon.'
http://www.dogmelon.com.au/solhelp/Pyramid Solitaire.shtml

In your phrase I guess it might mean something like "vorbringen" or "aus dem Hut zaubern"... :-)
Example sentence:

Hätten Sie mit Ihrem Veto Erfolg gehabt, das Sie bei jeder Gelegenheit und bei jedem Thema aus dem Talon ziehen (...), dann hätten wir, Frau Kollegin, überhaupt keine Handhabe gehabt.

As heiress of Castile, the question of Isabella's future marriage became a matter of increasing diplomatic activity at home and abroad. Portugal, Aragon, and France each put forward a marriage candidate.

Reference:

http://www.parlament.gv.at/pd/steno/PG/DE/XXII/NRSITZ/NRSITZ_00062/SEITE_0139.html

http://www.wga.hu/tours/spain/isabella.html

Something went wrong...
1 hr

draw from the reserve pile of 'undealt cards'

He (the matchmaker) most likely drew Hermann Kafka from his reserve pile of 'undealt cards'.

Evidently, the matchmaker had an easy time pairing other couples, but for some reason had not been able to find a match for Hermann Kafka.

In a word, Hermann Kafka had been relegated to a "reserve pile"of possible marriage candidates. When Julie became his client, and who - it seems - was not immediately attractive to potential husbands for some unstated reason, the matchmaker turned **to his "reserve pile of 'undealt cards' and drew Herman Kafka's name**.

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Note added at 5 hrs (2009-06-09 01:42:40 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

per Helen: in order to avoid overtranslating, you might prefer to go with "reserve pile", as in "The matchmaker drew H.K. from his reserve pile", and leave out the rest.
Peer comment(s):
neutral Helen Shiner : This seems a little over-translated.
1 hr
To be sure:-) I thought the idea that Hermann Kafka came from the matchmaker's "reserve pile" of candidates should be made explicit. Then, since the nature of the "reserve pile" seemed ambiguous, I included "undealt cards". But I did overtranslate!
Something went wrong...
+1
7 hrs

must have pulled the name out of a hat

my read :)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 hrs (2009-06-09 03:46:05 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

i.e. Kafka

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 hrs (2009-06-09 03:47:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

standard expression :)
Peer comment(s):
agree robin25
2 hrs
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